A new language Urdu developed after the advent of Islam in India. It was a mixture of Sanskrit based languages, Arabic and Persian (though Sanskrit and ancient Persian are very close). Urdu is a cultured language.
Sanskrit is an Aryan language and most European languages are related to Sanskrit. While Arabic is a Semitic language.
Few Arabic words in Urdu, Adami (Sanskrit is Manush), Sukriya (Sanskrit is DakSiNa, Safar (Sanskrit is Yatra or Car).
Prof. Kalidass Ghosh
Midnapore
URDU LANGUAGEReply
Arabic and Urdu ,shares similar script,hence Urdu speakers will be able to read Arabic( and other languages which resemble in script), and vice versa.But other than for few shared vocabulary and script,they might not be able to understand a thing and grammar is diff.Urdu have 60% resemblance to Sanskrit,while all the other 3 ;Arabic , Persian and Turkish, will together contribute to only 40% of loan words.Hence i would go for Urdu , originated from Sanskrit.But Foreign Script was adapted very soon due to the invasion and also religious influences.
Vbee
Arabic is another language.Urdoh readers might be able to recognize some of it,but definately won't be able to read it unless they have had any previous expirience.
Urdu have 60% resemblance to Sanskrit
kindly provide evidence.Urdu has sanskrit oriented grammar but it definately does not complies to it 100%.
Urdoh was never a launguage until the mid 1800's.Some muslim intellectuals in order to establish a unique identity of the indian musalman fabricated this.Other wise if you read mirza ghalibs work,most of it is in farsi.Very few is in so called urdoh or urdu.
Hence i would go for Urdu , originated from Sanskrit.But Foreign Script was adapted very soon due to the invasion and also religious influences.
your inferences are based out of sheer imagination.With no solid grounds.
This is also an ever debated topic.So probably there wont be a conclusion for this one, as well.
See, reading doesn't mean, reading to make sense....Like we can read any language written in English,we may be able to just read the alphabets together,not that we understand that language..That is what i meant by saying an Arabic, could read Urdu.
So if your point is an Iranian who speak Farsi, but do not understand any Hindustani language will be able to understand every bit of urdu,then i suggest we should try that.I left a message, hoping to hear from them.Lets see how they translate Mirza Ghalib's ''''Hazaroon khwahishen aisi ke har kwahish par dum nikle,bahut nikle mere arman,lekin phir bhi kum nikle''''
See Urdu literature ,especially poetry have been influenced by Persian,but that doesn't mean ' khari boli ''is totally replaced by a foreign language.It will have loan words and it might vary from poet to poet,on the extensive or limited usage of the alien language.One should not be conclusive, as u were trying to do.
I used the word Sanskrit' which was wrong , what i should have said was' Prakrit'' or the vernacular dialect of sanskrit,as Hindi and Urdu are variants of the same indic subdivision.
I am not an expert in languages , hence my observation skills may be limited.Kindly excuse.
Vbee
See the link to earlier discussions provided earlier.
I am surprised that so many people subscribe to Urdu having 60% resemblance to Sanskrit! It's NOT the case if you analyze the Urdu words & their origin.
In short, Urdu was born as a mix up of all foreign invader languages in India. The main contributors being Farsi, Arabic and Turki invaders who needed a common language for military garrisons. They had no idea of Sanskrit to begin with.
I doubt if Urdu was ever written with a left to right script that most other Indian languages use.
Urdu started as a Hindi written in (expanded) Persian or Farsi script, when outsiders (Afghans and others, including the early Muslim rulers) settling inIndia
Evolution of Urdu (Farsi scripted Hindi) at that time (several centuries ago) was quite similar to Roman (Latin scripted Hindi) recently which Mrs. Sonya Gandhi et al. read /write these days.
Some of the non-native Hindi speakers (like from South India and Europe etc. -- unfamiliar with Devanagari or Hindi script) wriie / read Hindi as 'Roman'. Urdu also was born like that from Hindi long ago.
I met a soldier long ago in India, and he mentioned about using 'Roman' in the army - that's how I found out about it.
Same thing as Urdu (initially, when it started) -- writing / reading Hindi using the Farsi script.
Surprising thing was, I read somewhere a while back, Urdu also started with army soldiers. For example, foreign Muslim soldiers long ago (especially working with horses and in stables etc.) came in contact with the locals (Hindi speakers) inIndia
the script for farsi has always been arabic.
Urdu or Urdoh means "language of the camp" anyways.
The grammar of urdu is sanskrit oriented.But the vocabulary is mostly arbo farsi.
Thanks
Not exactly. Arabic has been the basis for the Farsi script for about 1,300 years now. Farsi as a language is much older, and had another script in place before the Arab conquest of Persia.
do you know the basic difference between arabic script, farsi script and urdu script?
Arbi ( Arabic) is from the Semetic language tree.
Farsi (Persian) is from the Indo-European language tree.
Urdu also belongs to the second tree.
Just because all these three are written in a right to left format, they don't become 'same' script. The differences are huge.
> Farsi (Persian) is from the Indo-European language tree.
> Urdu also belongs to the second tree.
The language or the family it belongs has nothing to do with the script it is written in. Most Native American languages are today written in the Latin script, although they do NOT belong to the Indo-European family. All Dravidian languages are written in scripts that are derived from Brahmi, which is also the mother of most northern Indian scripts. Script evolution is a separate set of independent events that happened alongside language evolution.
Brahmi Characters Sanskrit Engraved on Rock - Kangra Fort
Can you give us some insight and save me some googling effort?
1. How old is Sanskrit language really?
2. How old is Rig Veda? (I have heard 25K years to 3.5K years)
3. Did Sanskrit have a 'mother' langage?
4. Per your view, did Sanskrit originate in India (Akhand Bharat) or move into India from somewhere near Caspian sea?
thanks
-T
http://www.geocities.com/lamberdar/sanskrit_sruti.html
http://www.geocities.com/lamberdar/vedas.html
Too bad, I am catching them after 3 years since you wrote. Quite informative.
Even though they answer some questions like Rig Veda's age, one thing about Sanskrit's "mother" language still remain open.
Things I liked in those links:
- It was difficult to be a 'Brahmin' per Vedas. I have also checked up upanishads that dictate almost a lifelong study ritual for a Brahmin.
- Possible causes of why Brahmins started encouraging their own sons to study Vedas
- Buddha's lack of Vedic knowledge which he 'rejected' like our friends here. Reject something without understanding it first!
- Vedas are full of praises & verses for common working class men/women. Your references were very good. Who says Vedas were that of 'elitist' forward caste people?
There is so much brainwashing done to modern day 'coconuts' by British & other western focused academicians. Too bad that Indians themselves aren't understanding the basics of their own heritage.
Btw education not being easy (and cheap perhaps - had to do lot of hard work to earn it) in olden times is explained in another article you might be interested in:
http://www.geocities.com/lamberdar/sruti_learning.html
You should check the following list and see if there is any other article of interest to you:
http://www.geocities.com/lamberdar/author.html
- Seva
I am glad that I came across a very knowledgable member in this forum.
Thanks.
http://www.omniglot.com/writing/persian.htm
http://www.omniglot.com/writing/arabic.htm
Farsi & Arabic are quite different. The difference is actually more than that between Bengali & Gujarati in Indian context.